Shopped and…not shopped
Feb 03 2010
Guess which is which!
Show record:
15 APHA points in Halter & Color! 3 APHA Points in Hunter Under Saddle!
105 PtHA points in Halter and Color!!!
Reserve World Champion Halter Pinto World 2007!!
World Champion Tobiano Color Pinto World 2008!!
3rd Place Open English Pleasure Futurity 2008!!
Um, this is why people make fun of horse shows and say they are stooopid. Because the Spotted Hunchback is out there winning. People DO come to the shows in person, you know, and bring their cameras. What are they supposed to think when they see mutant horse there in the second pic? At least it is a gelding, but still.
You can take an unflattering pic of any horse – I could make any world champion look like a crap from some angle if I tried – but even at worst, it shouldn’t look like a camel!
This is kind of the problem with a lot of the color registries – Pinto, Buckskin, Palomino. You have some really super nice, outstanding individuals showing at those shows. Then you have stuff where you just go, what is that and why did someone think breeding to make that happen was a good idea?…and sometimes it has all kinds of titles on it. I may not agree with everything that the judges like in AQHA, APHA, the Arab shows, etc. but at least there is more consistency. Why do you think the color registry shows are so all over the place like this? Is it because they’re so all-breed that there’s just too much of a mix of opinions among the judges? I still don’t understand how you can think that’s a halter champion, no matter what your breed of choice is.
And, oh yeah, don’t shop your horse to the point where its picture looks nothing like it. You don’t want the real version to be a disappointment. Ask anyone who has ever seen Pamela Anderson running around Malibu without makeup!
264 comments to “Shopped and…not shopped”
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I have scoured the web looking for other pictures of him. Guess what? I wasn’t able to find a SINGLE conformation shot. Shocking, I know. Plenty of ‘posed’ pics, but none that really show the ingredients, ya know what I mean? I DID however find out who the VICE PRESIDENT if the Florida Pinto CLub is, wanna take a guess? Amanda Palmer – The very OWNER of this camel she knows as ”T-Rex” or Switchs Big Leaguer. Well, I am not going to use up any more time on this. I still feel the same way I did from the beginning – I don’t change my mind a bit, and I GUARANTEE that anyone that has seen him feels the same way. Shame on you APHA and PtHA.
Amanda and Sami – Again, I apologize that your gelding (or for Sami – the get of your stud) had to be used as an example like this. I am happy he has a great home, I REALLY am. Freak breeding accidents happen sometimes – no one questions that. The cross of Switch and his dam worked out really well for both the other offspring, but sometimes the best laid plans… But I still maintain that he should have a great home OUTSIDE the APHA PtHA halter ring.
Here’s a photo of Wendy bully whippet. This is caused by mutant gene, but she looks like some of those horses.
Is that real? I was raised rescuing retired racing greyhounds….so I have a basic idea of how whippets are supposed to look!!!!! ANd that’s NOT it!!
That’s really a whippet. Full blood. There was a program on animal planet with her featured in it I believe. It’s a rare condition unique to whippets they said that causes super-muscles.
What kind of problems does that cause???? I know it has to cause quite a few….I hope nobody’s breeding the sire and dam anymore!!!
She didn’t seem to have any complications, or at least none they mentioned on the program she was just beefy. She wasn’t very quick on her feet because she was so bulky.
Who knows if they’re still breeding her parents though.
That puppy in your avatar is CUTE!!! =)
Yes, that’s my whippet Agnes. She’s adorable. Wendy the whippet is the product of a mutant gene which causes double muscling. The dog doesn’t seemed to be harmed by it in any other way, luckily. But it’s not a look anyone is breeding for, thankfully. But it seems that Wendy is a much loved dog.
Perhaps this is where that barfalicious over-muscled N/H stud gets his bulk:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-467985/Meet-Incredible-Hulk-Hounds.html
Doesn’t she remind you of that … thing … Zellgirl posted?
“Wendy was recently part of a genetics study done in the U.S. on mutation in the myostatin gene in whippets, which resemble greyhounds in appearance. The National Institute of Health study reported that whippets with one single defective copy of the gene have increased muscle mass that can enhance racing performance in the breed, known for speeds up to 60 kilometres an hour.
But whippets with two mutated copies of the gene become “double-muscled,” like Wendy. It has been seen before in one human, and also in mice, cattle and sheep, says the study.” (from another story)
Yes, it can be bred for: Belgian Blue cattle. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_Blue
Yeah, let’s check some of those halter abominations for mutated myostatin genes. Could be interesting!
Revolted, Ruthie
Goodness, that roach back is so horrible it LOOKS like some horrible photoshop job was done on it. Poor rider looks like she is about to hit the ground at any moment.
Apologies if this is a stupid question, but how easy is it to have a saddle fitted for those roach backed quarter-beasts?
All of the great comment here inspired to me write out a bit of a rant that summarizes a lot of what has been said:
http://showhorsegallery.com/articles/horses_arent_supposed_to_look_like_beef_cows
Okay, to answer a few questions/appeasing a general lack of knowledge about stock horses.
1. The purpose of HUS is mainly for Appendix bred quarter horses, to show a responsive, well trained english- style horse. There are also crossovers- purebred QH who are 15′3 to 16′1 that compete in both western and English events. Both of these types have a naturally low headset. They should be using their hind end as a driver, and are penalized if they are not. They are also penalized by the GOOD judges if their poll falls below their withers. Their poll should be slightly above the withers. They should be moving in a long, flowy “daisy-cutter” 2 beat trot, a working walk, and a collected canter. It is going to look different from a tb’s canter, because they are made differently. I assure you, horses without lift do not place well in this event.
2. Stock horses usually have a fake tail, not for the sake of “weighting” the tail, but for a flashier appearance. It does NOT cause a horse to have problems swatting at flies, if properly applied. My horse has never hesitated to do so with one in!
3. Most of us AQHA riders DO NOT support tying up the head, tail blocking, hormones, riding into the ground, forcing horses to do pleasure that are not naturally inclined to do so, or blood letting. Most of us find all of the above despicable and will gladly report any of this to the association, which, if there is sufficient documentation, will suspend these trainers from showing.
4. A lot of us are rather confused of the purpose of a “standard” that is unrideable. I know a lot of people, like I do, who feel that the standard should be rideable, not just “pretty” and as muscled as is humanly possible.
5. Our horses do have lift, and they SHOULD drive from behind. No, they are not going to look the same doing it as a hunter or a dressage horse because they are supposed to move more level than uphill.
A lot of people seem to have the misconception that a good horse is uphill, long strided, has a certain expression and moves one specific way, or it’s a terrible horse and the riders are terrible. That’s not true. Stock horses are not made to go like or have the expression of your Prix St. Gorges Dressage horse. He won’t. You would make him lame trying to convince him that’s a good way to go. I promise. I can also go on and on about things I think are disgusting in other disciplines, but I don’t because I know I get offended when people sit around dissing horses that are like my beloved stock horse (who is built better than most of their event horses and would beat them in an open halter class Sunday-Saturday, sad since she doesn’t even jump!!) so I don’t judge other breeds or their ways of going, as I feel it’s not my area.
Thank you for the explanation qhs, I do appreciate it. It helps me better understand how the Stock horse Hunter divisons work. As an Arabian person myself, I know that breeds can move differently (what an Arab does for western pleasure isn’t the same as a Quarter, and how Oldenburgs show hunt seat won’t be the same as an Arabian). My concern was looking at the horses who have their noses in the ground, polls below the withers; that was a worrysome position to be riding a horse in. My post on the previous page of a Congress Hunt Seat winner was what disturbed me. I am very glad to have your insight into this, and to hear that usually there are higher standards for the horse and riders’ overall positions than what that photo shows. Perhaps it was just an untimely photo. At any rate, thank you for the clarification!
QHS, Thanks for your explanation. One of the things I love about QHs is how smoooth they are to ride. That comes from a level, “Daisy Clipper,” workmanlike stride. My own QH is so smooth that even when he’s extended and trotting entirely too strongly, I can comfortably sit him, and I’m not in any kind of good shape. My foxhunting AQHA mare that I owned moved the same way.
Unfortunately, in both HUS and WP, I see the same old peanut rollers forced into a triangle of a frame poking around the ring and doing that horrid lurching “trope” that makes them look like handicapped zombies. They win at the County Fair, and they win at Congress. I don’t go to midlevel AQHA shows because I’m sure they’re winning there, too, and at least Congress has good shopping.
It would be AWESOME if I saw ANY truly collected, driven from behind horses winning. Moving LEVEL would be such an improvement over DOWNHILL. But it really has deteriorated into lowest head and slowest movement, no matter how much the horse is singlfooting, canted to the inside, LIMPING, etc. I applaud any REAL efforts to improve this, because I do know a lot of decent people like yourself who are mostly interested in showing their horse to its own best advantage.
Not every horse has the shoulder to elevate, I agree. But a real old-time QH sometimes sports that Morgan-like build that makes it possible, and it would be cool to see horses judged as… moving well and collected, as true to their individual conformation as possible. This is entirely possible in a single class, so long as the judges are educated enough to know the difference. An Appendix horse moving well would look different from a Foundation horse moving well.
I’ve seen a collected Foundation horse that you’d think was a purebred Andalusian, and I’ve seen plenty of QH’s succeed very well in the hunter ring.
This obsession with poll placement will always boggle me. If a horse is truly collected (Western) or on the bit (HUS), then its whole body will look balanced and poised, creating a harmonious image of a horse and rider working together. The total absence of contact you see in HUS just adds to the laughability of the event. Take that horse to a hunter show and ride him like that against QH’s that have always done hunters (and can actually jump more than 2′), and the difference becomes pathetic.
As for the tails, they look just as goofy as the Saddlebreds. Plus, they are by-products of the slaughter industry, and I can’t support that in any way, shape or form.
I’m all for softness and smoothness, a quiet ride and an obedient horse. I am NOT into the downhill, stiff-legged movement, spur stops, incorrect by ANY standard equitation, and borderline – sometimes BLATANT – lameness I’ve SEEN STILL WINNING in these stock horse classes. The AQHA started to try and change this a while back, but it’s not working yet. I hope they redouble their efforts. It would be awesome.
Thanks for that info. Those horses still look very strange to an Australian. we also have stock horses. They look nothing like that, being extremely agile and versatile. They can do it all – eventing, polo, endurance and of course, chasing cows. And they don’t carry their heads low. Here’s their website for you.
http://www.ashs.com.au/website/default.asp
It’s a very different look.
THANK YOU!!! Finally someone who is EDUCATED about stock horses and knows what they are talking about when it comes to them
I can’t even remember who that post was for….long week LOL
I booted around the net for about 5-10 minutes and there are some posts about horses developing roach backs from injury.
So theoretically this guy coulda been close to normal (I still don’t really like his back/loin/hip in even the baby pictures) and if he suffered an injury; could have made a “potential” problem into a reality.
Just sayin’
The way his hind legs are formed almost made me feel like the issue might lie in his legs? But I did a silhouette of his body. No paint splashes, no background, nothing to take away from his actual shape.
This is the original. Nothing altered about his shape. Although notice he was standing at a slight angle is you notice his hind hooves and slightly closer to the photographer. This is not enough to cause that hump though.
http://i45.tinypic.com/2ecm4qd.png
Definitely looks like it’s hands down a spinal issue (roach back).
Here I “cut off” some of his bum. Or, in essence, reshaped his spine without lengthening or shortening it. The white is the outline from the original rump.
http://i49.tinypic.com/w9v214.png
And here I altered his conformation by shortening his hind legs VERY slightly and lengthening the spine.
http://i45.tinypic.com/2rmxweu.png
All in all, he looks like he’s standing right under himself, but extending the legs would not significantly change the shape of the spine itself.
My conclusion? It’s not an awkward photo, it’s not his coloring….it’s his back. I’m not a conformation expert, and I certainly don’t consider myself the one who knows everything about everything about horses…but I’m pretty certain about this one based on my playing around with his silhouette.
Entering this horse in a conformation class is like me entering myself in a wet tee shirt contest. I should NOT be scored well and would feel really bad if I beat out someone who actually had the desired build!
For the record, my horse has a long weak back, very slightly swayed (doesn’t appear to be but saddle fit indicates a slight sway) that will probably increase when he gets old, a short flat croup, and a neck that is a little too long (but is a very pretty shape and set nicely on him). He has a good shoulder, pretty ballerina legs, nice chest, cute face, overall balanced build, and a golden soul. When you tack him up and put him to work, he makes a really cute dressage horse. But, had he not been gelded when I bought him I would have immediately done it myself, and I would never compete him in anything that judged his conformation!
I would not be offended if he ever ended up on this blog as an example of the qualities I just listed (and maybe some I haven’t mentioned!). It’s not like they aren’t obvious, or like I’m in denial or anything. I’d be more than willing to comment “yup, that’s my boy! Aren’t ya glad I know better than to show him halter or breed him?!!” I don’t see any reason for anyone to be offended by these things unless they actually consider it to be GOOD that their horse looks like that.
I found another side shot of him. The roach back and the post legs really stick out in this one….
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3076/3230955877_10163764a8_b.jpg
ick ick ick….okay this is horrible! I will admit I show in APHA shows and at any of the shows i have been to if this fugly thing was in the arena he most certainly would not have placed!!! I have gone to shows where the judges will make a decision and everyone is going why on earth did that thing place…ive learned that its all up to the judges so I better hope they know their stuff and dont place crap like this, it makes the APHA look bad!
I actually think this is an abnormality of the Lumbar Span (the last part of the horse’s spine, close to the pelvis.) Read the March 2010 issue of Equus to find out more, but for those of you that don’t get the magazine I will summarize some of it. Kyphosis is basically a second set of withers. It means the horse is safe to ride, and is sound, but the condition is heritable. Kyphosis sometimes causes the lumbar vertabrae to be congenitally arched, this makes it hard for the horse to extend it’s back for galloping or say…long trotting? Here is a picture of human Kyphosis if you can’t see the picture in the magazine. http://www.drjanduncan.com/slides/images/slide2.gif